5

I have stumbled upon this link on the web: http://www.languagesandnumbers.com/how-to-count-in-italian/en/ita/.
I states: "Numbers are grouped in words of three digits, with the specific rule that a space is added after the word for thousand if its multiplier is greater than one hundred and does not end with a double zero (e.g.: duemilatrecentoquarantacinque [2,345], seicentomiladue [600,002], settecentosessantacinquemila duecento [765,200])."
I cannot find any confirmation in any Italian source. Moreover, in some reports of Italian authorities, I always see such complex numbers written as a single word, regardless of the "double zero" presence.
So, is this rule a nonsense?

5
  • 2
    I never heard of it, and I don't trust too much that web page (for instance, biliardo is “billiards”, the game, not 10^15), but you never know.
    – DaG
    Commented Oct 13, 2017 at 16:57
  • 1
    I had half an idea that we already covered something similar: here it is. More importantly, in a page of the Treccani website you can find a counterexample to that alleged rule: seicentocinquantaquattromilatrecentoventuno for 654,321.
    – DaG
    Commented Oct 13, 2017 at 17:02
  • 1
    @DaG See treccani.it/enciclopedia/… for “biliardo”. Apart from that strange and wrong rule on adding a space, the page seems fully correct to me.
    – egreg
    Commented Oct 14, 2017 at 6:56
  • @egreg: Thanks. I just find it strange that this word only appears in the Enciclopedia della matematica and in no other reference work, either by Treccani or other publishers (and I used to be a mathematician, so this is not some sort of prejudice).
    – DaG
    Commented Oct 14, 2017 at 8:48
  • @DaG I find it strange too. Personally I prefer American style “small scale”.
    – egreg
    Commented Oct 14, 2017 at 9:00

1 Answer 1

5

I have never heard that rule. In Italy we learn to read and write numbers this way:

Reading and writing 3 digits numbers:
100 = cento. It is an exception to the rule, you read “cento”, not “unocento”.
200 = duecento
300 = trecento
400 = quattrocento
430 = quattrocentotrenta
432 = quattrocentotrentadue
707 = settecentosette

RULE:
if, after thousands, you have a 80 number, you have to delete one “o”:
180 = centottanta (not: centoottanta)
287 = duecentottantasette (not: duecentoottantasette)
if, after thousands, you have number 8, you have to leave the double “o”
708 = settecentootto
808 = ottocentootto

Reading and writing 4 digits numbers:

fist of all, in Italy we write 1.000 with a dot to group thousands, not comma.
Comma is used as “decimal point”, which separates decimal numbers from the whole number.
A number in standard form is separated into groups of three digits:
1.000 10.000 100.000 1.000.000

To read them, 1.000 is an exception to the rule, you read “mille”, not “unomila”
2.000 = duemila
3.000 = tremila
10.000 = diecimila
15.000 = quindicimila
100.000 = centomila
107.311 = centosettemilatrecentoundici
765.200 = settecentosessantacinquemiladuecento (your example)

RULE TO READ:

  • you read the number at the left of the dot
  • you read the dot as “mila”;
  • you read the digits at the right of the dot. If you have only “zero” digits, you have to stop:

10.000 = diecimila (“10” = dieci + “.” = mila “000” = nothing to write or read)
199.000 = centonovantanovemila
199.007 = centonovantanovemilasette

Reading and writing 6 digits numbers:
1.000.000 = un milione 1.001.001 = un milione e milleuno

Reading and writing 10 digits numbers:
1.001.001.001 = un miliardo, un milione e milleuno

507.935.399.011 = cinquecentosettemiliardi, novecentotrentacinque milioni, trecentonovantanovemila e undici

507.935.888.333 = cinquecentosettemiliardi, novecentotrentacinque milioni, ottocentottantottomila e trecentotrentatré

Reading and writing 13 digits numbers:

1.000.000.000.000 = un bilione (= mille miliardi)

1.001.001.001.001 = un bilione, un miliardo, un milione e milleuno

Hope this helps.

6
  • Good answer. It might be worth mentioning that sometimes one might also see an apostrophe (') used as a symbol to group thousands, especially in scholastic contexts.
    – Easymode44
    Commented Apr 12, 2019 at 13:10
  • 1
    @Easymode44 the apostrophe is only used in Swiss italian (e.g.: caffe.ch/stories/economia/…). In Italy a high dot is sometime used instead of the normal one, mainly in handwriting (I guess there's a specific Unicode character for it, but I'm not sure). Commented Apr 12, 2019 at 15:42
  • 1
    The apostrophe is never used as a separator, just the dot. Some publishers, however, shun the dot and prefer a half-space.
    – DaG
    Commented Apr 12, 2019 at 21:06
  • 1
    Personally, even though they are defined in the vocabularies, I'd avoid bilione (and its cousin trilione), since in my experience only misunderstanding and confusion come from them.
    – DaG
    Commented Apr 12, 2019 at 21:08
  • 1
    Wow, I'm impressed by the comments! I myself going to school in Rome have been taught (at least up until high school) to use apostrophes when separating groups of thousands. I might have had a quaint (or Swiss) teacher, I guess, nevertheless good point @OldManofAran, it is mainly in handwriting that one sees this.
    – Easymode44
    Commented Apr 13, 2019 at 12:18

Your Answer

By clicking “Post Your Answer”, you agree to our terms of service and acknowledge you have read our privacy policy.

Not the answer you're looking for? Browse other questions tagged or ask your own question.